Sisters In Sobriety with Sonia Kahlon and Kathleen Killen

Early sobriety can feel euphoric, terrifying, lonely and unexpectedly funny—sometimes all in the same day. In this episode of Sisters in Sobriety, Sonia and Kathleen explore what the first days and months without alcohol actually look like and share practical ways to manage cravings, triggers and life after rehab. They are joined by Heather Chappell and Zoe Kachan, host and co-host of Girl, Undrunk, the raw, unfiltered sobriety podcast that finds humor in the highs, lows and messiness of recovery.

What happens when someone returns from rehab to the same apartment, routines and drinking cues they left behind? How do friendships change when alcohol is no longer the thing holding them together? Heather and Zoe discuss the “rehab high,” the fear of relapse, sober community, dating without alcohol and the surprising challenge of discovering who they are when drinking is no longer shaping their personalities.

The conversation examines emotional sobriety, mental health and the slow work of developing coping skills that alcohol once replaced. Heather and Zoe explain how meetings, sponsorship, therapy, firm boundaries and supportive sober friendships helped them build safer lives. They also share simple approaches to cravings: staying in the present, following the possible consequences of a drink from beginning to end, leaving overwhelming situations and naming uncomfortable feelings out loud.

Heather and Zoe also open up about the experiences that led them to treatment, from isolation and deteriorating health to job loss, a DUI and repeated hospital visits. Their stories continue beyond getting sober, revealing the anger, trauma and relationship patterns that resurfaced in recovery. An honest discussion of sober intimacy explores how the body can carry fear even when the mind feels safe—and why patience, communication and self-trust matter while learning to date and connect without alcohol.

This is Sisters in Sobriety, the support community that helps women change their relationship with alcohol. Check out our substack for extra tips, tricks and resources.

Episode Highlights 02:00 Heather’s loneliness, anxiety and escalating drinking in New York 05:00 The call that finally took Heather to rehab 06:00 Zoe’s early drinking, drug use and need to fit in 09:00 A DUI, hospital visits and Zoe’s last attempt to start over 11:00 Leaving rehab and facing the first 90 days 12:00 Resisting an early craving at the dog park 13:00 Building a protective routine around high-risk hours 15:00 Discovering that personality and humor survive sobriety 17:00 Relearning adulthood after years of drinking 19:00 Mental health, emotional sobriety and alcohol as a coping mechanism 21:00 Meetings, sponsorship and rebuilding confidence 22:00 Therapy, anger and confronting the past without alcohol 24:00 Everyday triggers and rewiring the brain 26:00 Leaving unsafe situations and setting firm boundaries 29:00 How sobriety changes friendships 32:00 The chance meeting that brought Heather and Zoe together 40:00 Dating, relapse and protecting early recovery 44:00 Sober intimacy, dissociation and learning to trust the body 49:00 Day-one advice and how to name a craving

Girl, Undrunk Links

Instagram

SIS Links

💌 Sisters In Sobriety Substack – where the magic (and the mocktail recipes) happen

📬 Sisters In Sobriety Email

📸 Sisters In Sobriety Instagram

🌐 Kathleen’s Website Kathleen does not endorse any products mentioned in this podcast

📸 Kathleen’s Instagram

Can unresolved emotional pain influence alcohol cravings, addictive behaviors, and the way the body experiences stress? In this episode of Sisters in Sobriety, Sonia speaks with Dr. Bradley Nelson, holistic physician and bestselling author of The Emotion Code, The Body Code, and The Heart Code, about his approach to identifying and releasing what he calls “trapped emotions.”

Why can someone understand a harmful pattern and still feel unable to change it? Could addiction be less about the substance itself and more about an attempt to soothe emotional pain? Dr. Nelson shares his perspective on the subconscious mind, biofeedback, muscle testing, alcohol cravings, and the “heart wall”—a protective emotional barrier he believes can form after heartbreak, grief, trauma, or loss.

The conversation explores how emotions may go unprocessed, how present-day triggers can connect with earlier experiences, and why Dr. Nelson views symptoms as messages rather than root causes. He demonstrates the sway test, explains the Emotion Code chart, and describes his process for narrowing down an emotion, deciding whether more context is needed, and using a magnet or hand movement to release it. These practices are presented as Dr. Nelson’s energy-healing framework and are not a substitute for evidence-based medical, mental health, or addiction care.

Dr. Nelson also opens up about the childhood experiences that shaped his path, including a serious case of measles, kidney disease, and an early encounter with holistic practitioners in rural Montana. He traces the journey from computer programmer to chiropractor and shares stories that led him to connect physical symptoms, heartbreak, compulsive behavior, and emotional healing—including accounts involving chronic pain, food cravings, and alcohol use.

This is Sisters in Sobriety, the support community that helps women change their relationship with alcohol. Check out our substack for extra tips, tricks and resources.

00:00 — Dr. Bradley Nelson and the concept of trapped emotions 02:00 — Childhood healing experiences and belief in a higher power 05:00 — From computer programming to the healing arts 06:00 — Searching for the roots of patients’ symptoms 07:00 — Addiction as a response to emotional pain 09:00 — The subconscious mind as the body’s internal computer 11:00 — Muscle testing and yes-or-no biofeedback 13:00 — How emotions may become “trapped” in the body 16:00 — Emotional baggage, anxiety, PTSD, and addictive behavior 18:00 — The overflowing-glass metaphor for emotional pain 20:00 — How the “heart wall” may relate to addiction 22:00 — Why the heart is viewed as more than a pump 26:00 — A patient story connecting heartbreak and chronic neck pain 29:00 — Introducing the ring-in-ring method and sway test 36:00 — Using the Emotion Code chart to identify an emotion 38:00 — Closing an emotional “open loop” 42:00 — How emotional baggage may drive cravings 45:00 — A story about alcohol urges and releasing the heart wall 48:00 — True healing versus symptom relief 51:00 — A small next step and where to learn more

Dr. Bradley's Links

Instagram

Website

SIS Links

💌 Sisters In Sobriety Substack – where the magic (and the mocktail recipes) happen

📬 Sisters In Sobriety Email

📸 Sisters In Sobriety Instagram

🌐 Kathleen’s Website Kathleen does not endorse any products mentioned in this podcast

📸 Kathleen’s Instagram

Addiction treatment has not always been designed with women in mind—and that can profoundly shape how women experience recovery. In this episode of Sisters in Sobriety, Sonia is joined by Dr. Stephanie S. Covington, internationally recognized clinician, author, and pioneer in addiction and trauma treatment, whose groundbreaking work includes A Woman’s Way Through the Twelve Steps, Helping Women Recover, Beyond Trauma, and Awaken Your Sexuality.

Why do traditional addiction treatment and Twelve Step programs sometimes fail to reflect women’s actual experiences? How are trauma, relationships, sexuality, shame, and addiction connected? Dr. Covington examines why recovery can look different for women, what conventional relapse prevention may overlook, and why community and connection are so essential. She also discusses the gaps in addiction treatment within jails and prisons, the importance of continuity of care after incarceration, and why she prefers the term “criminal legal system” over “criminal justice system.”

The conversation breaks down the relationship between childhood trauma, genetics, emotional development, substance use, and relapse. Dr. Covington explains when trauma and addiction may need to be treated simultaneously, the difference between trauma-informed, trauma-responsive, and trauma-specific care, and the powerful shift from asking “What’s wrong with you?” to “What happened to you?” She also offers a gender-responsive perspective on the Twelve Steps, reframing concepts like the Fourth Step in ways that can reduce shame and help women see themselves more clearly in recovery.

Sonia also gets personal about working the Twelve Steps nearly nine years into sobriety, feeling disconnected from the male-centered language of traditional AA literature, dating and having sex sober for the first time, and navigating conversations around “Cali sober” and mindful substance use. Dr. Covington shares her own early experiment with moderation, why she has no desire to test whether she could drink again, and a surprisingly simple “green beans” test that can reveal just how much power alcohol or another substance has in someone’s life.

This is Sisters in Sobriety, the support community that helps women change their relationship with alcohol. Check out our substack for extra tips, tricks and resources.

Highlights

00:01:00 – Meet Dr. Stephanie Covington and the personal recovery story behind her pioneering work

00:02:20 – What early addiction treatment and Twelve Step programs got wrong about women

00:03:35 – Why women-only recovery spaces can create greater safety and vulnerability

00:04:00 – Addiction, incarceration, and the lack of real treatment inside jails and prisons

00:06:00 – Medication-assisted treatment, Twelve Step access, and what is missing behind bars

00:07:00 – Why recovery community can be critical for successful reentry after incarceration

00:08:35 – Sonia shares that she is working the Twelve Steps nearly nine years into sobriety

00:09:20 – Why A Woman’s Way Through the Twelve Steps reframes recovery through women’s voices

00:10:00 – Reimagining the Fourth Step as a compassionate “spring cleaning” of the self

00:14:00 – Should AA literature change, and why Dr. Covington focuses on the Twelve Steps over the Big Book

00:16:00 – The Twelve Steps as tools for living, not simply tools for stopping drinking

00:17:00 – Why meetings, connection, and community strengthen long-term recovery

00:18:30 – How trauma and addiction become intertwined and why genetics is only part of the picture

00:21:00 – When trauma and addiction should be treated together rather than sequentially

00:23:30 – The three major relapse risks for women: trauma, relationships, and sexual issues

00:25:30 – Why childhood trauma can have a particularly profound developmental impact

00:28:00 – Big-T versus little-t trauma—and why comparing trauma can be misleading

00:30:00 – Relationships, sexuality, shame, and the overlooked realities of women’s recovery

00:33:00 – Sonia opens up about dating, intimacy, and having sex sober for the first time

00:37:00 – Trauma-informed, trauma-responsive, and trauma-specific care explained

00:39:00 – The origin and power of shifting from “What’s wrong with you?” to “What happened to you?”

00:44:00 – Cali sober, switching substances, moderation, and whether addiction can be “transcended”

00:49:30 – Dr. Covington shares her own failed experiment with having “just one” drink

00:50:30 – The 30-day experiment and the unforgettable “green beans” test for evaluating alcohol’s role

Dr. Covington's Links

https://www.stephaniecovington.com/

https://www.instagram.com/stephaniecovingtonofficial/

SIS Links

💌 Sisters In Sobriety Substack – where the magic (and the mocktail recipes) happen

📬 Sisters In Sobriety Email

📸 Sisters In Sobriety Instagram

🌐 Kathleen’s Website Kathleen does not endorse any products mentioned in this podcast

📸 Kathleen’s Instagram

Addiction can gradually disconnect people from the ordinary pleasures, relationships and experiences that once made life meaningful. In this episode of Sisters in Sobriety, Sonia and Kathleen help make the science of addiction recovery practical and accessible with Dr. Eric Garland, a clinical researcher, psychotherapist and leading expert in mind-body therapies for addiction and chronic pain. Dr. Garland is the developer of Mindfulness-Oriented Recovery Enhancement, or MORE, an evidence-based treatment that combines mindfulness, cognitive behavioural therapy and positive psychology.

Why do alcohol and other addictive substances begin to feel more rewarding than everyday life? How are addiction, chronic pain, depression, anxiety and trauma connected? Dr. Garland explains how substance use changes the brain’s dopamine and reward systems, why cravings can become automatic, and how mindfulness can create a pause between an urge and an action. He also discusses relapse prevention, emotional pain, moderation, harm reduction and the role of meditation in 12-step recovery.

The conversation breaks down the three pillars of MORE: mindfulness, cognitive reappraisal and savoring. Dr. Garland explains how mindfulness strengthens attention and awareness, how reappraisal helps people examine the consequences of their choices, and how savoring retrains the brain to experience pleasure from ordinary moments. He also shares techniques for observing cravings, “playing the tape forward,” rebuilding natural reward and using the STOP practice before engaging in an addictive behaviour.

Sonia reflects on how rediscovering simple pleasures and developing new hobbies contributed to a profound identity shift in her own sobriety. Dr. Garland shares how his personal mindfulness practice shaped his career, why recovery can involve transcending an addiction-based identity, and how people can reconnect with meaning, joy and a version of themselves that is larger than any craving, painful feeling or past behaviour.

This is Sisters in Sobriety, the support community that helps women change their relationship with alcohol. Check out our substack for extra tips, tricks and resources.

Highlights

00:00 Dr. Eric Garland and the MORE approach 02:00 How mindfulness shaped Dr. Garland’s career 04:10 Addiction, chronic pain and the loss of natural reward 07:00 Clinical research and the effectiveness of MORE 08:00 Reducing relapse, cravings, pain and emotional distress 10:00 Why people use substances to escape pain 12:00 Mindfulness, reappraisal and savoring 15:00 How addiction hijacks the dopamine reward system 18:20 Practical ways to relearn pleasure in recovery 20:00 The mindfulness loop and strengthening attention 23:00 Recognizing triggers and automatic cravings 25:00 Zooming into the physical experience of a craving 28:00 Playing the tape forward through cognitive reappraisal 30:20 Mindfulness, pain and emotional bypassing 32:00 What traditional addiction treatments may be missing 34:00 Finding reward in coffee, birdsong and everyday moments 40:00 Sobriety, identity change and self-transcendence 43:00 MORE, the 12 steps and responding to a lapse 46:00 Harm reduction, moderation and opioid treatment 49:00 The STOP practice for interrupting automatic behaviour 53:00 Expanding MORE through training, community and technology

Dr. Garland's Links

SIS Links

💌 Sisters In Sobriety Substack – where the magic (and the mocktail recipes) happen

📬 Sisters In Sobriety Email

📸 Sisters In Sobriety Instagram

🌐 Kathleen’s Website Kathleen does not endorse any products mentioned in this podcast

📸 Kathleen’s Instagram

What if the parts of you that feel stuck, afraid, or hard to explain are connected to something deeper than this lifetime? In this episode of Sisters in Sobriety, Sonia and Kathleen explore hypnosis, identity, past lives, intergenerational trauma, and spiritual healing with Boris Walter, a Psychotherapeutic Consultant specializing in parallel metaphysical phenomena, commonly referred to as past lives, and founder of the Consciousness Integration Collective. Boris helps people locate their inner authority by remembering who they are beneath fear, protection, and conditioning.

Boris shares how his path moved from offshore oil and gas work into psychotherapy, hypnotherapy, altered states of consciousness, and spiritual exploration. Together, Sonia and Kathleen ask: What is the difference between personality, identity, and the true self? Can hypnosis help people access parts of themselves that ordinary talk therapy cannot reach? Are past life memories literal, symbolic, or both? And how do fear, shame, family trauma, and old protective patterns keep people disconnected from their own inner knowing?

This conversation opens up a grounded but expansive discussion of the ego, the unconscious mind, hypnosis, higher consciousness, and the ways trauma can live in the body. Boris explains how hypnosis can soften the grip of the ego, move people beyond the social mask, and allow them to access imagery, emotion, memory, and meaning that may not be available through conscious thought alone. He also explores the idea that healing is not always about proving whether an experience is “real,” but about understanding the themes, emotions, and false beliefs that are asking to be transformed.

In the personal story portion of the episode, Boris reflects on the childhood experiences, family dynamics, spiritual encounters, and early client sessions that shaped his work. Kathleen also shares her own powerful experience in Egypt and the unexpected emotions that surfaced during the conversation. The episode moves into a deeper discussion of ancestral memory, intergenerational trauma, Indigenous history, and the possibility that healing may involve not only this lifetime, but the wider field of family, body, spirit, and consciousness.

This is Sisters in Sobriety, the support community that helps women change their relationship with alcohol. Check out our substack for extra tips, tricks and resources.

[00:01:00] Boris shares the unexpected path that took him from offshore oil and gas work into psychotherapy.

[00:02:00] Why money, success, and a “good job” still left Boris feeling unfulfilled.

[00:03:00] Boris explains how wanting to understand himself and his mother’s mental health led him toward psychology.

[00:04:00] Kathleen relates to Boris’s career change and the feeling of being called into therapy work.

[00:06:00] Boris discusses childhood wounding, ego compensation, and finding work that is no longer driven by the wounded self.

[00:07:00] Why traditional talk therapy felt incomplete to Boris, and what he believed was missing.

[00:09:00] Boris explains why he became interested in altered states of consciousness and experiences that transcend the mind.

[00:10:00] The first client experience that introduced Boris to past life material and higher-self perspectives.

[00:12:00] Kathleen asks whether Boris was spiritual before these experiences began appearing in his work.

[00:13:00] Boris describes his early fascination with paranormal activity and parapsychology.

[00:14:00] Boris shares a profound DMT experience that changed his understanding of divinity, purpose, and love.

[00:17:00] How client sessions began shifting Boris’s personal spiritual practices and relationship with his body.

[00:18:00] Kathleen asks whether there is such a thing as a “true self.”

[00:20:00] Boris explains personality as a social mask and identity as a structure that creates stability.

[00:24:00] Kathleen asks what hypnosis is and what happens in the brain during a hypnotic state.

[00:26:00] Boris breaks down beta, alpha, and theta brainwave states and how hypnosis creates openness.

[00:29:00] Boris explains how hypnosis can help people access higher-self perspectives, guides, past lives, and deeper emotional material.

[00:34:00] Kathleen asks whether past life experiences should be understood as literal, symbolic, or something else.

[00:41:00] Kathleen shares her own powerful experience in Egypt and the theme of feminine power that emerged.

[00:49:00] Kathleen asks about intergenerational trauma, Indigenous clients, residential schools, and inherited memory.

Boris' Links

Website: https://www.boriswalter.com Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/boriswalterofficial

SIS Links

💌 Sisters In Sobriety Substack – where the magic (and the mocktail recipes) happen

📬 Sisters In Sobriety Email

📸 Sisters In Sobriety Instagram

🌐 Kathleen’s Website Kathleen does not endorse any products mentioned in this podcast

📸 Kathleen’s Instagram